What happens when caring for someone else turns into trying to control, fix, or save them?
In this episode of The Hanley Effect, hosts Dr. Rachel Docekal and Dr. John Dyben welcome clinical psychologist, author, and recovery advocate Dr. Sarah Michaud for a candid conversation about codependency, addiction, boundaries, and learning to take responsibility for our own well-being.
Dr. Michaud has worked in the addiction field for more than 30 years and has been sober for more than 40 years. She is the author of Cocrazy: One Psychologist’s Recovery from Codependency and Addiction and co-host of the Leaving Crazytown podcast. Drawing from both her professional expertise and personal recovery journey, she explains how codependency can quietly take hold in relationships, and why recognizing it can be an important part of healing.
Dr. Michaud describes codependency as becoming more preoccupied with another person’s thoughts, feelings, and behaviors than with our own needs, beliefs, and emotions. It can show up in relationships affected by addiction, but it isn’t limited to them. Codependent patterns can emerge between partners, parents and children, and even in otherwise loving relationships when fear drives us to manage another person’s choices.
The conversation explores one of the most difficult challenges for families affected by addiction: understanding the difference between helping and enabling. For parents especially, stepping back can feel terrifying when the consequences of a loved one’s substance use may be serious. Dr. Michaud explains why repeatedly rescuing someone can unintentionally prevent them from experiencing the responsibility and natural consequences that may be necessary for change.
She also discusses how these patterns can appear in everyday parenting. When parents continually do things their children are capable of doing themselves, their desire to help can inadvertently communicate that the child isn’t capable. Healthy boundaries, she explains, aren’t about controlling another person’s behavior; they’re about deciding what we ourselves will and will not accept.
The discussion also turns to recovery itself. Sobriety doesn’t automatically resolve the relationship patterns, people-pleasing, fear, or difficulty speaking up that may have developed over a lifetime. For Dr. Michaud, meaningful recovery includes learning to tolerate uncomfortable emotions, identify our own needs, establish boundaries, and shift our attention away from trying to change other people.
At the heart of the episode is a powerful idea: we cannot base our peace on whether someone else behaves the way we want them to. Whether we’re dealing with addiction, codependency, parenting, or intimate relationships, lasting change begins when we stop looking outside ourselves for control and start taking responsibility for our own choices and recovery.
In This Episode, You’ll Learn:
- How Dr. Michaud defines codependency and why it can be difficult to recognize
- How codependency can develop in relationships affected by addiction
- Why fear and the desire for control often drive codependent behavior
- The difference between supporting someone and enabling them
- Why allowing natural consequences can be important for children and adults
- How codependency can appear in parenting, marriage, and other relationships
- Why families and loved ones need their own recovery
- How guilt and shame can make boundary-setting especially difficult for parents in recovery
- Why boundaries are about our own choices rather than controlling someone else’s behavior
- How people-pleasing and self-sacrifice can continue long after someone becomes sober
- Why learning to tolerate uncomfortable emotions is an important part of recovery
- How shifting from an external to an internal sense of control can lead to healthier relationships
- Why taking responsibility for our own recovery can be empowering rather than punitive
About Dr. Sarah Michaud
Dr. Sarah Michaud is a clinical psychologist in central Massachusetts who has worked in the addiction field for over 30 years and has been sober for over 40 years. She is the author of Cocrazy: One Psychologist’s Recovery from Codependency and Addiction and co-host of the Leaving Crazytown podcast.
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